I'm thinking I want to upgrade the range on my M4. Right now, I can get about
125ft -150ft (@ 350FPS w/ .2's) before accuracy starts to get iffy; the gun is bone stock right now. What I'm thinking is this:
A Tanio Koba Twist Barrel around 459mm, a silencer or barrel extension to support the extra length of the new barrel, and a soft firefly V-bucking.Though maybe a new spring also as I've heard that if you shoot over 330 FPS with a TK twist barrel, it begins to lose accuracy. Maybe an M100, possibly M90. Aren't the Firefly V-buckings supposed to put a better back-spin on the BB because they contour more evenly to the BB? Because I'm thinking that with the consistent backspin combined with the TK twist barrel, the range should be a good 200' or so. At least, that's the goal. I also want to replace the nubbing, but I don't know which to get. MadBull H-Nub perhaps? Or maybe just a basic Systema nubbing?
Thoughts and suggestions are all very much appreciated. Thanks!
Currently. with my low experience with the barrel (piston stripped in the G36c I was using as a test bed) and what I have found on the 'net (in the TK twist thread) The TK twist barrel should work its magic at 330fps or less or so, as a 1J limit is what it was engineered for. Again, I have not had a great deal of experience with mine yet. Think of the TK Twist barrel as helping a AEG do more with less. Part of the reason I like the idea of it is supposed too gain accuracy and consistency at lower velocities, perfect for CQB fields and unmodified TMs.
In your case, I think your M4 is shooting in what I consider a "sweet spot" fps wise, you can use .20s effectively and you can use .25s for those targets in the heavy brush or far away. If you have not tried out a bag of .23 or .25s yet, give them a shot (pun) I think you will be pleased with the difference at range. What I have done with some of mine is a good quality tightbore and a madbull shark or systema bucking, again 200' accurately, not so much, but I can reach that range.
Is it possible to reach 200' with a AEG accurately, yes, I think it is obtainable but I think it would need a lot of upgrading and be very expensive, it may even put you about c3s fps limits. To be accurate at that distance does not just mean a heavy spring and a new bucking. It requires consistency and tuning, in any replica including BASRs, this is not cheap and it is even more expensive in a AEG.
It would also require a "sniper rifle" weight BB like a .29 or better to make use of that extra velocity which means crappy performance with .20s. Look for a thread on ASF called; " a DMR is not cheap" or something similar.
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Is it possible to reach 200' with a AEG accurately, yes, I think it is obtainable but I think it would need a lot of upgrading and be very expensive, it may even put you about c3s fps limits. To be accurate at that distance does not just mean a heavy spring and a new bucking. It requires consistency and tuning, in any replica including BASRs, this is not cheap and it is even more expensive in a AEG.
It would also require a "sniper rifle" weight BB like a .29 or better to make use of that extra velocity which means crappy performance with .20s. Look for a thread on ASF called; " a DMR is not cheap" or something similar.
I've considered these factors, and that's why I want to go with a twist barrel. Everything I've seen on different forums as well as through a google search supports that they work wonders, and so I'm willing to take the risk. Though, since it only works its magic at around 330FPS or less, I want to stay generally close around that. 350 is pretty close, but, as springs are fairly cheap, why not play it safe and downgrade it closer to 330 or so.
Now as for hop-up, I want advice as per the best possible set-up. I know the Systema bucking with systema nub is popular, but FireFly V-Buckings are said to be great because of some type of V shape inside that "hugs" the BB as it flies through it. With an even backspin, combined with the minimal resistance produced by a Twist barrel, I'm thinking 200 or so is easily obtainable, and at a not too expensive price. I've found Twist barrels in stock on RedWolf, and the one that I'm looking at is around $66 shipped. The bucking is a around $20 or so, and the nubbing I'm still on the fence on. I can't decide what brand to get or if I should get a new one at all.
BB weight, well, that can't be avoided. I'm going to have to go up to .25's or so, but that should bring 330-350 down to around maybe 300 +/- 15 FPS, which is still decent. A little faster than TM guns, and I know plenty of people at the field run guns below 300, and are generally happy with it.
I'm not really going for a DMR so much as a generally longer range all-purpose rifle. Perhaps if I can get it accurate enough, I might buy a $15 scope from Walmart, and a cheap bipod. But for now I'm just aiming to upgrade the range in general. Either to be used in conjunction with a Red Dot, or just the Irons.
The whole set-up might a little bit over $100, but considering that if I used the conventional way (I.E. TBB w/ new bucking, new spring, high-torque motor, as well as a reinforced piston and gears, etc.), a reliable build may be more expensive, and will definitely require A LOT more work.
OK, after a bit of extra research, I think I have a cheaper hop-up arrangement in mind. A standard Systema bucking with an SCS H-nub. It should run around $20 as opposed to $30 before, and should also be a much safer purchase.
I'm starting to have doubts about the twist barrel though. I really do want to install and try one, but at the same time, if it shows no real difference, I'm out over $60. I want to get as tight a grouping as possible, but I don't know which diameter to get. GR-16's come stock with 6.04 TBB's, and so I don't think 6.03 would make a considerable difference for $30. 6.01's on the other hand, are almost as expensive as a twist barrel, and require frequent cleaning, among other things.
I'm thinking I should set more realistic goals with the new plan, I just want tighter groupings at around 150ft. I suppose maybe just upping the hop-up, and using .25's should make a considerable difference, but is a tighter barrel even necessary?
*Edit: After reading this thread: FireFlys and SCS nubs I am now completely and utterly lost.
Screw it. I'll just get a systema bucking and an H-nub of some kind. So long as it's rubber and not plastic.
Again, I already took the plunge and bought a TK Twist and a MadBull 60 Degree Shark Accelerator Hopup Bucking (Red) (this is a H nub), I will be posting my experiences (honest) as soon as I have anything to report. In the mean time try out some .25s and see what you think. Read up on this article FPS and BB weight, the science behind it It is a couple of pages long but worth it.
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low observability, high firepower, high drag, low speed Do NOT anger the forum Illuminati, please search
Team STAG
Quote P7hk9 "Just do it as a TEAM and not as Master Chief."
Again, I already took the plunge and bought a TK Twist and a MadBull 60 Degree Shark Accelerator Hopup Bucking (Red) (this is a H nub), I will be posting my experiences (honest) as soon as I have anything to report. In the mean time try out some .25s and see what you think. Read up on this article FPS and BB weight, the science behind it It is a couple of pages long but worth it.
Thanks for the advice. I wasn't ignoring what you posted above, I was just trying to look at all the options. I'm in no rush to upgrade, so for now I'll just use some heavier BB's, and await your results with the Twist barrel.
You will be pleased with the .25's. All i can say is that ever since i started using them about 2 months ago, my groupings have become much tighter and less bb adhd is noticed. Right now i am hitting a circular target at 100 feet that is no more than 6 inches in diameter 5/10 times with mild cross-winds. I believe that for an airsoft gun aeg, thats accurate and pretty consistent.
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